Mr. Adnan Oktar's live conversation with Mr. Jeremy Gimpel, host of Tuesday Night Live in Jerusalem (18 January 2012; 22:00)
Excerpt from Mr. Adnan Oktar's Live Conversation on A9 TV dated January 18th, 2012
Ms. DAMLA: We will be patching through to Jeremy Gimpel. He is an Orthodox Jew and an internationally known radio and TV presenter. He has a radio program broadcast every week on Israel National Radio. He also presents another radio program every Tuesday. That program reaches 30 million people in America by cable. The program deals with the Old and New Testaments and is intended to tell people from all sections of society about the existence of Israel, Jewish history and the End Times. Jeremy Gimpel is frequently sent abroad by the Israeli government to talk in universities, churches and synagogues. He is opposed to evolution and believes in Creation. The video of this interview will late be published on the Israel National News web site and broadcast on Jewish Life TV in America, insha'Allah.
ADNAN OKTAR: Fine, then let us speak. Go ahead. Mr. Gimpel, How are you?
JEREMY GIMPEL: Yes. I'm doing great, thank you.
ADNAN OKTAR: Yes, go ahead, I am listening, Mr. Gimpel.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Yes. I want to know, first and foremost, of all of the news that's happening about Muslims wanting to kill Jews, why does Mr. Oktar support Israel as a Jewish state?
ADNAN OKTAR: Israel is much mentioned in the Qur'an. Almighty Allah speaks of the Prophet Moses (pbuh) in the Qur'an, and of the prophets Abraham (pbuh) and Joseph (pbuh) and Jacob (pbuh). Now we have a duty to protect and love children of the prophets Joseph (pbuh), Jacob (pbuh), Solomon (pbuh) Abraham (pbuh) and Moses (pbuh). It is incompatible with the moral values described in the Qur'an to hate the children of the prophets. Almighty Allah tells us in the Qur'an that we may marry the People of the Book and eat their food and do business with them. He does not tell us to be their enemies. That is why we cannot go along with the extremists, strange and loveless people who offer nothing but pain and bloodshed and who follow satan. We must act according to the conception of love in the Qur'an.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Well, I understand that there should be peace between Jewish people and Muslims, but I want to understand about the Jewish state. The Jewish people having a political presence; establishing a country in their homeland, as stated in the Bible; is there a theological basis for the Muslim world to accept the Jewish people establishing a state in the Middle East, in their homeland?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course, Almighty Allah says in the Qur'an that you were born there and you will live there, and that you will be taken out of there. There is a verse of the Qur'an about that. You can read the English of that verse. So the ruling in the Qur'an is quite clear and explicit.
JEREMY GIMPEL: So there is a theological basis in the Qur'an for the Jewish people to live in the land of Israel?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course. In addition, the graves of all your forefathers are there. All your past and your forebears lie there. That is your homeland. It is perfectly natural and reasonable for you to live there. That would be the case even if there were no such commandment in the Qur'an. Nobody can claim anything else.
JEREMY GIMPEL: There are many prophecies in the Bible that speak about one day, the Jewish people returning to the land of Israel from all over the world, and today we see in Israel Jewish people from all over the world, from Asia and Africa, from North America and South America, and we're seeing the promises that God made to us fulfilled today, and I want to know if there is an understanding in Islam that if it is happening, or if it has happened, then it must be God's will?
ADNAN OKTAR: Those parts of the Torah about the Mahdi are in complete agreement with the hadiths of our Prophet (pbuh). The great majority is in agreement. I can say it is just about all in agreement. The return of the Jews to Israel is a sign of the coming of the Mahdi, the Messiah. It proves we are in the time of the Mahdi. It is impossible for anything else to happen. The Mahdi must have come. There is no second commandment regarding the re-foundation of Israel there, its being a state once again. So the event described in the hadiths, and in the Torah, has come about. It is a clear sign from both signs of the coming of the Messiah the Mahdi.
JEREMY GIMPEL: So why does he think there's such a battle of faiths between Jews and Muslims when we believe in the same Torah, we believe in the same promises, and we have the same father, Abraham? That 's what I don't understand.
ADNAN OKTAR: They used to imagine that the Mahdi who will appear to Muslims and the Mahdi who will come to the Jews are different people. But I have shown and proved that they are one and the same. This is most excellent, a great blessing. People were largely unaware of that. It was an unknown fact. But when we examine the Torah with care we see it is in complete agreement with the Mahdi described in the hadiths of our Prophet (pbuh). We see they are in agreement regarding the timing, and of the portents involved. And in terms of his shedding no blood, bringing peace and democracy and friendship and love and art and science, in short, in all respects.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Well, that's interesting. Will the Messiah, in his mind, be Jewish? Will the leader that he speaks of, that will bring peace and brotherhood, will this person be Jewish? Will he be a Jew?
ADNAN OKTAR: He is descended from the Prophet David (pbuh). But I believe that he will be a Muslim, of course. But in terms of the Jews, I believe he will be one of the people of Noah.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Interesting. What does he think is the key to bringing peace between Jews and Muslims?
ADNAN OKTAR: Only the presence of the Mahdi and the Messiah. Otherwise, it is impossible. The world would become a sea of blood. There would be no end to the pain and suffering. And indeed there is no end to it, as you can see. But with the Mahdi, peace, brotherhood, tranquility, art, science, goodness and beauty will quickly spread all over the world. There will be plenty and abundance. The walls surrounding Israel will be brought down. Israel will live in plenty, goodness and abundance in the Promised Land, the boundless Promised Land together with their brothers. Palestinians and Israelis will walk around hand in hand and dance, and rejoice together, and there will be a bright and happy world. But this will only come about through Moschiah, the Mahdi, or Shiloh. Jewish people do believe in this. And the date for this is 2012. As you know this is a known date amongst Jews. We have now entered that date. The Torah shows us the King Messiah, the Mahdi, is living now. We can see that from the Zorah and the hadiths. We can see it from statements of Sunni and Jafri scholars, from everything. The only thing left is for rational people, for sensible true believers, to come together and decide about the subject of the Messiah. That is all. Once that is done, peace and brotherhood will soon come to the world.
JEREMY GIMPEL: How will we know who the Messiah is? If you think he's a Muslim and I think he's a Jew?
ADNAN OKTAR: According to my belief Hazrat Mahdi (pbuh) will be a Muslim. He will be a member of Islam. But he will rule the Jews with the original of the Torah. That is what the hadiths of our Prophet (saas) say. I mean, he will not try to convert the Jews to another belief. He will govern them with their own Scriptures. And he will govern Christians with the originals of the Gospels. And he will rule the Muslims with the moral values of the Qur'an. Consequently he would not adopt any manner that would interfere with anyone's beliefs. But in terms of the Jews, his beliefs will be like those of the people of Noah. And for a Jew someone from the people of Noah would not be in conflict with his own beliefs. So there will be no problem in terms of belief.
And he also asked about the portents, I think, didn't he? Right, he asked about the portents.
They are described in great detail in the Torah. We must look at the Torah. We must ask Jewish scholars, Judaic scholars and Muslim scholars. They will easily establish that. Because where he will appear, what he will do and how he will work have all been described in detail. It is all described at length in the Torah as well. Jewish and Muslim scholars can easily find him in the light of those portents. It will not be at all hard.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Interesting. As a Muslim, when he sees Israel, surrounded by so many enemies that want to destroy her with militaries that are much bigger than theirs, with many more people than them, does he believe that God is protecting Israel?
ADNAN OKTAR: Of course. Power always lies with Allah. Nothing will befall Israel until the Day of Reckoning because they are the line of the prophets. But the reason for that now is the Mahdi, the King Messiah, who is alive at the moment. It is through him that nothing like that is happening now. That is set out in the Torah and the hadiths. The King Messiah is the reason why the Day of Reckoning is on hold. Allah has halted it through the King Messiah. Otherwise the Day or Reckoning would long since have taken place. We can see this in the Torah as well as in the hadiths. The fact that people are unaware of it is not important. But at the moment the reason for the foundation of the state of Israel is again the King Messiah, the Mahdi. And the reason why Israel is protected is again the King Messiah/ Mahdi. Allah protects Israel because of him. I can show you some 100 proofs from the Torah, and more than 200 from the hadiths of our Prophet (saas) to prove the matter.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Why does he think that there must be such a conflict in the Middle East today between Jews and Muslims? What is God's purpose in doing this?
ADNAN OKTAR: To oblige people to look for and find the Mahdi. That is why Allah is making them do it now.
JEREMY GIMPEL: What does he think the Arab world has to learn from Israel?
ADNAN OKTAR: The Arab world learned to be religious from Israel. In that respect it has been exceedingly useful to Palestine, and particularly to Egypt, and it even taught being religious to Morocco, Tunisia, Algeria and Lebanon. It thus encouraged religious devotion. Because Egypt was socialist before that, as was Palestine. I mean they were communists. But they practically envied being pious when they saw that Israel was so religious. They also became religious, in a kind of positive competition, in a kind of positive envy and they have striven to become even more devout. In that regard it has been most beneficial.
JEREMY GIMPEL: What does he think the Jewish people need to learn from Islam?
ADNAN OKTAR: They will learn the teachings of the Prophet Abraham (pbuh) from Islam. They will learn the teachings of the Prophet Moses (pbuh), of the Prophet Noah (pbuh). They will learn the beautiful moral values, the love of peace, the rationality and benevolence and all the beautiful aspects of the prophets of the past. We can see these things when we look at the Qur'an.
JEREMY GIMPEL: What does Mr. Oktar most admire about Israel?
ADNAN OKTAR: We like your being religious and desiring peace. I love the way you await the Messiah, the Mahdi. But most of all, because you are descended from the prophets. That is a delightful thing.
[I like the fact that] You love Allah and I like knowing that we will rebuild the Masjeed of Solomon together. The fact that all the prophets are buried in Israel; I love Israel for many reasons. And I love the people of Israel.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Does he believe that the Jewish people will build a third Temple now where the Dome of the Rock is now in Jerusalem?
ADNAN OKTAR: Shiloh, the Mahdi, will rebuild it. If we say that the Jews will be doing it, that will not be compatible with the Torah. The King Messiah, Shiloh, will rebuild the Masjeed of Solomon exactly as it was.
JEREMY GIMPEL: And where will Solomon's Temple be?
ADNAN OKTAR: I had the location shown the other day. I can show it if we can find a bird's eye view. But let me say it will be the central part. A little bit behind the central area between the two mosques.
JEREMY GIMPEL: A little bit behind what?
TRANSLATION: It is in between the two mosques
JEREMY GIMPEL: Interesting. Will Muslims join us in praying to God in this temple?
ADNAN OKTAR: Christians, Jews and Muslims will all pray in the Masjeed.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Why don't we start building that temple together now?
ADNAN OKTAR: You must first locate the Messiah. You are to find the Messiah before all else. An Israel that does not believe in the importance of the Messıah will be ruined and perish. Allah will bestow no plenty and abundance on it; He will only bestow unease. But through the Messiah, by means of Messiah, Allah is now bestowing plenty, peace and safety on Israel. Israel and devout Israelis must realize this very clearly. And I believe that they have seen it. And trying to do anything without the Messiah would not suit the feeling of respect towards Allah, and Allah will never permit it. And it would be pointless to try to do something that Allah will never allow. It would only end in disaster. The best thing is to find the King Messiah, the Mahdi before all else and to rebuild the Masjeed of Solomon and to return to those fine days under his administration. The smell of roasting flesh of sacrificial animals will spread as far as Jericho, insha'Allah.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Ah-ha. What would Mr. Oktar like to give a message; what message would he like to give to the Jewish people in Israel?
ADNAN OKTAR: They must be more devout. They must love Allah more. They must oppose Darwinism and materialism more determinedly. They must do scientific work and attach more importance to science. They must abandon separation and division. They must pray to Allah to find Messiah. They must altogether raise the subject of the King Messiah. They must speak with Muslim scholars as well and strive to find and make Moshiach, the Mahdi, their leader. They must accept him as their leader and they must make him the leader of the Islamic world as well. And then Allah will bestow abundance, plenty, ease and beauty that has never ever been seen in the history of the world. Democracy, goodness, beauty, peace and love will enfold the world. All these scourges, terror, anarchy and war will all disappear. Not a drop of blood will ever be shed. The sleeping man will not be woken. Our Prophet (pbuh) even says, "People's noses will not even be made to bleed." The climate will be that compassionate and loving and that beautiful. That is why the key lies in Jews becoming more devout and attaching great importance to Hazrat Mahdi (pbuh).
JEREMY GIMPEL: When does he think that the King Messiah will appear to us?
ADNAN OKTAR: He has come. He is already here. All that needs to be done is for theological scholars, great rabbis and Muslim scholars to come together and agree on the existence of the Mahdi and to look for him. When they start to look for him, they will find him very easily as he has already come. I would not speak that openly if I hadn't known what I was talking about.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Well, I would like to bless Mr. Oktar that he continues spreading peace and love throughout the world, and that we truly see the King Messiah reign over the entire world and bring peace, love and prosperity to all of us.
ADNAN OKTAR: Insha'Allah. I know you are devout believers. That is why I love you all very much. Salam.. May goodness and beauty be upon you. My greetings to all the people of Israel, and all Palestinians. I love you all very much. My respects to all your citizens there, Christian, Jew or Muslim.
JEREMY GIMPEL: Thank you; shalom.
ADNAN OKTAR: Salam.