Mr. Adnan Oktar's live conversation with Knesset political adviser Prof. Avraham Diskin on A9 TV (3 January 2012)
Excerpt from Mr. Adnan Oktar's Live Interview on A9 TV dated January 3rd, 2012
ADNAN OKTAR: We are through to Israel, aren't we? Who will we be talking to?
DAMLA HANIM: Professor Avraham Diskin.
ADNAN OKTAR: Avraham.
DAMLA HANIM: Yes, he is a political expert who has advised various prime ministers, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Knesset. He served as head of the Political Science Faculty at Israel's Jerusalem Hebrew University. He is also a professor at the Interdisciplinary Center in Herzliya, an institute for policy and strategy. His views as a political analyst are frequently sought by the Israeli and international media. He chaired the Cadets' Committee of the Israeli Ministry of Foreign Affairs in the 1980s and 1990s. He also helped to write the Constitution in the 2000s and advised the Constitution Committee of the Knesset.
ADNAN OKTAR: Let us put him through. Prof. Diskin, how are you?
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: I'm fine. I'm okay. Okay.
ADNAN OKTAR: Masha'Allah. That part was fine, masha'Allah. Yes, Professor Diskin, go ahead, we are listening.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Okay, okay. So first of all I would like to ask Mr. Oktar; I understand that he's very active with the bonds of the three monotheistic religions, and I'd like to know more about his ideas concerning that.
ADNAN OKTAR: We are in the End Times. According to the Torah and the Holy Scriptures and the hadiths of our Prophet (saas), we are in the End Times. The time has now come for people to be one community, insha'Allah. Under the leadership of the King Messiah, the Mahdi, people will be friends and brothers. Mankind has now seen that this conflict and these wars and anarchy are all the work of satan, of the antichrist [anti-messiah]. We want to live in peace. Today everyone is taking everyone else to court and they are all oppressing, beating, swearing at and insulting one another. They detest each other. That is something horrible. And that is a terrible thing. Forgiveness and love and peace are beautiful things. And we are striving in that way, insha'Allah, as followers of the Messiah, of the Mahdi. We want goodness and beauty to rule the world.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Yeah, I understand that, but you know over the years, actually over thousands of years, there were at least some very orthodox believers who did not look so peacefully on other religions. And unfortunately even today we have, for instance, some Muslims who are very intolerant to those who aren't Muslims, and the question is how optimistic one can be under such conditions?
ADNAN OKTAR: The good will always be victorious. They will always be victorious. We can see how the good are heading toward victory in the End Times. The supporters of brute force and violence and terror are being put down, crushed and humiliated. The good and right ones, the supporters of love, are growing ever stronger. This is happening before the eyes of the whole world. This is a most positive development.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: I believe that Mr. Oktar wrote after the 9/11 terrorist attacks in New York and Washington a very important book called Islam Denounces Terrorism, and I would like to learn about the reactions to this book, not in the non-Muslim world, but in the Muslim world, which I think is more interesting.
ADNAN OKTAR: Generally speaking, the supporters of satan and the antichrist do not like peace. But Muslims, and especially Muslims in Turkey, are highly rational people who love peace, love, friendship and brotherhood. They espouse democracy. In that respect, Turkey is a fine role model for the Middle East, the Balkans and the Islamic and Turkish worlds. That is why it has become a natural leader, and will further strengthen that natural leadership post. It will be the leader of both the Islamic and the Turkish worlds. And under that leadership, Armenia and Israel and other states, and members of other faiths and nations will all live together in tranquility, peace, joy, happiness, plenty and abundance.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: First of all I would like to say that everyone who supports this between all people regardless of their beliefs and origin should be blessed. I would like to ask a question about the relationship between Turkey and Israel. In the past, there were very, very good relations not only at the level of governments between Turkey and Israel, but also between the peoples, and it looks that as of recently, there is a sort of deterioration both on the governmental level, and also a growing hostility at least among parts of the peoples, and I wonder if one can be optimistic about the future given these developments?
ADNAN OKTAR: The truth of the matter is that things have never been good between Turkey and Israel, between the Islamic world and Israel in that sense. But they will be now. They will be good in the time of the King Messiah, the Mahdi. If things were ever good, that was just on the surface. I mean, Israel has never enjoyed friendship, closeness or a climate of security with any country in the true sense of the word. Not if we are being realistic. There have been military agreements and commercial agreements. But there has always been that suspicion and tension. I mean, there has never been a climate of love and brotherhood at the level described in the Torah and the hadiths. It is happening for the first time, or will happen for the first time. For the first time in truth. That is why all Israeli intellectuals must support this development. They must pray to Allah for the coming of the King Messiah, for the coming of the Mahdi. They must beg Allah in the synagogues. Our intellectual Israeli brothers or the ones who hold different political opinions, they all have a duty to seek the Mahdi, the King Messiah, from Allah. Otherwise, superficial friendships are meaningless. For example, America and Israel are friends, but there has never been true friendship between them. There has never been a reliable climate. I mean, whether it be American Protestants or Orthodox or Catholics, the attitude toward Israel has never been of the kind we want to see, as set out in the hadiths and the Torah. This will be the very first time. People have to be realistic and strive to behave in a good manner befitting this fine age.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: In Israel, there is a lot of concern about the present regime in Iran, which seems to be very hostile to Israel, for instance not only denying the Holocaust of the Second World War but calling once again for the elimination of the state of Israel. I'd like to ask what Mr. Oktar thinks about it?
ADNAN OKTAR: These are empty dreams, of course. Such a thing will never ever happen. The Qur'an explicitly states that the Jews will live in and remain in Israel. Nobody can prevent that. Israel is destined to remain there. There is mutual interaction in Iran. There is a mass fixation with Iran. Shiite belief has this idea of the invisible Mahdi. [According to this belief] he has been lost for 1,000 years, and occasionally appears to a few people, and he tells them his ideas. That is what they believe. There is a notion of blood-shed in this kind of belief system. That is why they have these dreams of the elimination of Israel, of Israeli children hiding behind stones and trees, but the stones and trees will tell them they are hiding there, and they will also destroy them in a huge genocide. This is horrible and repellent, of course. It is a belief which is a sin for Muslims, it is murder. It is diametrically opposed to Islam and the Qur'an. Persecution is therefore never pleasing to Allah. It is again the Mahdi, the King Messiah, who will get rid of this false belief in Iran. There are such false beliefs in much of the Islamic world. I mean there are such false beliefs in Sunni creed as well. In other words, there are many bigots, many extremists who hold erroneous views, and want to butcher Alawites and Bektashis. That is why Allah is showing everyone that the King Messiah is essential if this bloodshed, persecution and cruelty are to disappear from the world. All these things will disappear in the time of the Mahdi, the King Messiah. If they say they attach no importance to this, then the antichrist will devastate the world. But if they do attach importance to the Mahdi, the King Messiah, then Allah will lift that scourge from them, and they will live in peace and security.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Another issue which I think is exciting for all of us is what is called the "Arab Spring", and in Israel there is also a lot of sympathy toward those who looked for reforms throughout the Arab world, but there's also some concern that these hopes will not be fulfilled, and that we're going to have either once again brutal military regimes, or the rule not of peace-loving Muslims like Mr. Oktar, but all kinds of extreme Muslims which are more similar to those who conducted different terrorist attacks, including the 9/11 attacks just ten years ago, and I wonder if Mr. Oktar is hopeful of the future, or does he share our concern as well?
ADNAN OKTAR: They are telling the truth. Of course, the antichrist will be anywhere in which there is not the way of the Mahdi, of the Messiah. There will inevitably be pain and suffering. For example, the system in Libya and Iraq and other countries will become harsher because they encourage people to persecute and oppress one another. Cruel people are highly admired, in other words. That is the case in many parts of the world, just about everywhere. The way of the antichrist has taught people that. People who espouse bloodshed and want to inflict pain, suffering and unease are much admired. Good people are generally left lagging behind. This is the manifest signature of the age of the King Messiah. It is a clear sign that the King Messiah has come because the description in the Torah is exactly like this. We will now see peace in the age of the King Messiah, the Mahdi. People will see the power of Allah. Peace will rule the world, despite all these tyrants, murderers and despots. But it is of course very important for believers to pray to Allah and to act as one and support one another.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Okay, you mentioned the Messiah etc. I have a couple of friends who I consider to be religious, believing in God, believing in Creation, and nevertheless they also believe in evolution, not in an atheistic way; but they believe evolution could have been there, and if you look back on the Creation by God. I know that this is a very heavy question, but I'd like to learn whether Mr. Oktar thinks that one can believe in God and believe in Creation, and also believe that evolution could have been there.
ADNAN OKTAR: Were evolution true, I would have supported it from the outset. Why deny it if it were a scientific fact. We would have said that Allah created through evolution. And that would have been entirely reasonable as well, because the sperm and the egg meet in the womb and assume various forms. Then a child is born, but the stages in between do not much resemble a child. Just like this system works, we could have then said that Allah created other living things with the same kind of system. But when we look rationally and scientifically, using all the means made available by science, we never encounter any evolution. Why deceive ourselves? There is no such thing. There are 350 million fossils, and there is not even one, single evidence that implies evolution, that points to evolution. All those 350 million fossils -may be more- prove Creation. We look at the structure of proteins. We ask all the evolutionists and scientists, but all of them scientifically.. We ask Buddhists and atheists. We ask whether these could have come about by chance. And they all say they could never, ever be the work of chance. What do they say? They say they must definitely have been created. They say that someone must have created them. Maybe entities from outer space, or something else [may Allah forbid]. But they say they are definitely the product of a superior intelligence. So it would be pointless to deceive ourselves when we know all these things.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: I know that Mr. Oktar published the first volume of the Atlas of Creation and I wonder if he plans to establish following volumes in the coming future?
ADNAN OKTAR: I have published three volumes. The fourth is ready, it is already being printed in Turkish. Work on volumes five and six is continuing. The work is very wide-ranging, and naturally takes a great deal of time.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: I apologize that I'm not updated.
ADNAN OKTAR: Estagfirullah.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Okay, let me just say that I think that Mr. Oktar is one of the most interesting people with whom I've ever had the opportunity to talk to, and it really was a pleasure and a delight, and I really hope to have more opportunities to talk maybe in person during one of his visits to Israel, or maybe when I visit Turkey, so anyway I thank him very much for the opportunity.
ADNAN OKTAR: And thank you. It has been a pleasure. Insha'Allah, we will meet in Jerusalem. That is in any case essential. But I also hope to see you in Turkey. I send my respects and affection.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Okay. Thank you very much.
ADNAN OKTAR: And thank you. Salam.
PROF. AVRAHAM DISKIN: Shalom, shalom.