Mr. Adnan Oktar's Live Conversation with Mr. Charles Ries, the former American Ambassador to Greece (29 November 2011; 21:30)
Excerpt from Mr. Adnan Oktar's Live Interview on A9 TV dated November 29th, 2011
ADNAN OKTAR:Good evening, have a blessed evening. I am not quite sure if it is the night time there, but anyway. How are you?
CHARLES RIES:I'm very well, thank you very much. Thank you for having me.
ADNAN OKTAR:I also thank you. We can start with our conversation.
CHARLES RIES:Well, we're very interested in the attitudes in Turkey towards the developments today and yesterday in Egypt. How are you seeing the election in Cairo, and what do you expect to come forward in the relationship between the Egyptian people and their military?
ADNAN OKTAR:The developments in Egypt as well as those in other Islamic countries will generally develop within the framework of the system of Hazrat Mahdi (pbuh). We already see that they are proceeding within the line of the system of the Mahdi. And we see that the demands are in line with this as well. For instance the public opinion in Libya is also in favor of the Unity of Islam and in Egypt as well the public opinion is in favor of the Islamic Union. In Turkey the same thing holds true, but this will manifest itself in the form of the system of the Mahdi. The King Messiah, Moshiah, referred to in the Torah, and Mahdi, as referred to by the Muslims, are the same person. All over the world, an age of peace, brotherhood, democracy and love will arise. The age of violence, the age of conflicts will come to an end. Terror will come to an end. Within the next ten years we will witness this happening stage by stage. But in Egypt, events may surely proceed for some time. This holds true for other Islamic countries as well, but it will not be of a very serious extent. A war to break up in the Middle East is out of question. We believe that Prophet Jesus (pbuh) is in the world right now. That is, we believe that he has descended and Hazrat Mahdi (pbuh) has appeared. Because events have developed just as we depicted and all incidents proceed to appear in this way, people see that what we say is true. That is to say, this is not a demagogy or an obsession about a belief, this is a fact.
CHARLES RIES: Well, thank you very much. Do you think that the change in Egypt that is taking place now will be able to lead to greater prosperity and economic growth for the Egyptian people?
ADNAN OKTAR:In my opinion it will not be possible for some time. That is to say, conflicts wil persist for some time . A quiescence will come about with the system taking root , the Unity of Islam being formed and the repercussions of the system of the Mahdi reaching there. Indeed in Egypt there exists the thinking of taking Turkey as a model. This, in any event, means adoption of the model of the system of the Mahdi in Turkey. That means; democracy, peace, brotherhood, approaching people with clemency and kindness, advocating science and artistry has gained acceptance in this region. They have taken Turkey as a model. But the model in Turkey is the model of the system of the Mahdi. As a result we understand that they have embraced the model of the system of the Mahdi. This is a good development for Egypt.
CHARLES RIES:Well, I agree with you that there's a great deal of respect for Turkey and the Turkish model in Egypt, and throughout the Middle East and the Arab world these days. The question really is the inevitable question associated with revolution; whether the first regime to take responsibility in the aftermath of a revolution will have the ability to meet the hopes and dreams of the people, or regardless of its own talents, it will be overwhelmed by the challenges and the people themselves will be disappointed with it. The risk, it seems to me, for the next government of Egypt is actually a risk of expectations. The people expect that having turned out the Mubarak regime and having undertaken these big challenges to create a democratic regime where the people can speak and state what they want, that the government that takes power will actually not be able, because of the constraints of the turmoil and the international economic situation to be able to create the positive, strong economic growth that Turkey has today. Turkey has undertaken tremendous efforts since 2002 to build the economic record that it justly is proud of. The problem for Egypt, it seems to me, is that within a year, there will be a new elected government taking power in Egypt, quite possibly with very deep Islamic roots, and yet the people will be interested not only in its affiliations, its religious affiliations, but also in it's ability to produce better economic growth and deal with the economic crisis in Egypt. So what worries me is that no matter who wins the elections, the challenges, the economic challenges that they have will put in question the transition there.
ADNAN OKTAR:The people of Egypt would not attach much importance to economic structures. I mean right now religion is considered to be what is essential. They dwell on resolving the problem over religion. The people are also content with a very plain life. This is the case in all Islamic countries right now. Especially in Egypt. The purpose of people is not welfare; [their purpose is to] live by the morality of the Qur'an in the full sense of the word, to experience the system of the Mahdi, and to have the souls satisfied spiritually. Otherwise, eating good or riding in luxury cars is of no concern for the Egyptians. They have no such concerns. Everyone can see this if they look with a rational eye. The sole purpose is the Unity of Islam; it is the Union of Islam and to live by the Qur'an, to live by the morality of the Qur'an in the perfect meaning. Everyone can see this when they consider the matter rationally.
CHARLES RIES: Well, you may well be right, and if that's the case then we will see a very successful transition in Egypt. Here in the West, or least in the United States, many of the analyses of what's really happening in Egypt point to a “Lost Generation”; a generation between [the ages of] twenty and thirty where there are no jobs, there's a very significant university educated population in Egypt for which there are no jobs. The government sector has become smaller, and the industry in Egypt is not very competitive and so these people have not been able to acquire any kind of income with which to start a family, and so they very much are at odds, waiting for some development for them to begin adult life, and that is seen as a considerable factor in the disaffection with Egyptians for the Mubarak regime. Not the entire factor, I agree with you, the repression of religious activities in Egypt has been part of what it is that caused this revolution, but it seems to many looking at it from the outside that one of the challenges, for the next government of the great state, the great country of Egypt will be able to restore a sense of pride and progress in Egypt which has been really very devastated by the revolution; people have less income, less food, less ability to make their way in the world, and that is what we worry about as to the longevity of, and of course, they need to work out a new relationship with their own military, a relationship where the people understand the role of the military in the protection of the country, and the military understands that the people can set policy for the country. Those are the challenges that Egypt faces in the coming six months to a year, and I think that all of Egypt's many friends in the wider world, not just in this country but in Turkey and in Europe, and around the world, in the Arab world hope that it can find its way, [that it can] find a balance that can allow the people of Egypt to be the great people that they truly deserve.
ADNAN OKTAR:Yes.. In Egypt, Muslim Brotherhood is the powerbroker. That is to say, the organization that has come to power right now is the Muslim Brotherhood, the Muslim Brotherhood organization. The main notion of the Muslim Brotherhood is the system of the Mahdi. They used to express this in an explicit manner. In their meetings they had statements in Arabic such as; "No madrassas, no education; The Mahdi will appear." Therefore they also believe that the Mahdi has appeared and that we are in the time of Hazrat Mahdi (pbuh) and seek to live as Muslims. For instance they may readily agree to sit on the floor in their homes, they can subsist on half a loaf of bread and some little cheese but under all circumstances they want to live by Islam. That is what they essentially demand. Or else, installing the industry, economic welfare, giving a future of ease to the children; only one or two percent of Egyptians can be of this mindset. 98 percent of them, on the other hand are of this idea; they are of the idea of the Muslim Brotherhood. It is very simple to get to know this; this is a fact that can easily be seen when examined, when observed.
CHARLES RIES: Well, if you're right than they will be happy.
ADNAN OKTAR:We will see such a structuring in the entire world. For instance, the reason for the economic crisis in Europe is getting far removed from the true religion. The crisis has begun because people are getting far removed from religion. For instance, the reason for the wealth of America is its belief in the existence of Allah. You know even on the American dollar, there is a phrase stating that they believe in the existence of Allah [In God We Trust is inscribed on all U.S. currency]. States and nations believing in Allah get stronger and more successful. In the event that there exists no belief in Allah, an economic crisis happens and [states] collapse. The entire world has witnessed this. Even in Greece the clergy came together and prayed. They asked for measures to be taken so as to improve piety. They all acknowledge and agree that they have come to this state because of the absence of religious education and the weakening of religion. Irreligiousness kills people's strength, activity, exuberance and the power of creating. It kills people's joy of living. Thus emerges an economic crisis and collapse.
CHARLES RIES:I think that is one way of looking at the present circumstances in the world. One question about that though is how do you explain the success of China, where they are not very religious at all?
ADNAN OKTAR:China has lost its human feelings. One can say that there are no people left there; they have almost turned into robots. Go to China and look at how people have become mechanized. They have become the components of machines. There are machines out of steel on one hand and of flesh, machines of human beings, on the other. They have made people bereft of humanity. They have been enslaved and spiritually degenerated. They have been deprived of their souls. It is impossible for us to treat China as a model. Rather we can assess it as a model of the system of dajjal (anti-messiah); as an example of the devastation of humanity. In China people are in a devastated state. The state is rich; that is to say, it is the state that has the possessions but the people lead a dog's life. They live almost like animals in cells of a few square meters. They live in a miserable state, they work for peanuts; there exists the system of slavery. Therefore China is a non-human model; briefly, it has no aspect that can be interpreted positively. China is a society of terror where there exists no democracy, no arts, peace, exuberance and joy.
CHARLES RIES: I would note that the situation in China has gotten a lot better than it was before. Chinese people have bigger apartments, more food, they are growing more strong than they have before. But obviously, China is not a perfect society; the United States is not a perfect society for that matter. We all have to continue to strive to get better. Let me just say that I did live in Turkey in the 1980's, and have great admiration for Turkey and the Turkish people.
ADNAN OKTAR: We also love Americans very much. We love the American people very much. They are peaceable, joyful, companionable, gracious and quality people.
CHARLES RIES:Thank you very much. Is there anything else I can do for you this afternoon? And I want to thank you very much for having me on your show.
ADNAN OKTAR:I invite you to Turkey. We are expecting you together with your spouse. We can have a panel discussion here, converse, talk and host you. And you could stroll around Istanbul, that would be nice.
CHARLES RIES:Thank you very much, and we'll try to come visit, if I have can, in Istanbul and I'm very much grateful to you for inviting me, and I wish you well.
ADNAN OKTAR:I also thank you.